Beyond the App: Building Trust and Winning Over Customers in the Nigerian Fintech

Hello and welcome to the show. Before we begin, I'd like to shout out Julian Bassey. He is the CEO of Crimson Energy and he's also a listener of the podcast. You can check out his website at Crimson Crimson dot Ng that is Crimson dot Ng in case you have alternative energy needs. You know solar panels, those sorts of things that are based out of Lagos, but they do they're looking at opening some business outlets here in Abuja.

So check them out. He's a listener of the podcast. He reached out on LinkedIn. We've been chatting. We might have some engagements in the future. So just shouting him out over here. Then I also like to give a shout out to Kolac Ball tell me to play open. I'm pronouncing the name correctly because I'm actually used to doll Akbar that is DO. So this is the first time I've come across a call Lakbar, which is Kola. So collect what Timmy to pay.

He's with Quantum Travels, also a listener of the podcast who has reached out to me. We're chatting back and forth. You know, LinkedIn, WhatsApp messages might do some work together in the future. So let's see. I hope I haven't missed any shout outs recently. You know, some people reach out after a podcast episode. Sometimes I remember the shout out, sometimes I don't. But just in case you followed and I haven't shouted you out,

you know, it's not a slight. It's just that sometimes I forget, you know, it's not like I have a production manager for the show or something. So yeah, I was like, OK, yeah, so we were on challenges of selling your fintech ideas in Nigeria. That's what the last maybe 4 episodes have been about. And today I want to tackle another problem that these boys and girls, in particular in the fintech space have. So we've used a rough definition that fintech you're basically just using digital technology and you're trying to solve problems in the financial space.

So for instance, two or three weeks back, for some reason my GTB card didn't work, GTB app didn't work. It wasn't just me. I don't know if it was an Abuja thing or a nationwide thing, but for like 2-3 days couldn't do anything doing GTB. So if some smart kid comes up with the idea that you can use blockchain to solve this problem because you create some monster app and all transactions on it are verified or whatever and you're building some latency or you know this is not my space so I'm just freestyling here.

So whether it can be done or it can't be done, I don't know. But bottom line, you come up with something and the advantage is that any which way, Internet or no Internet, this thing will work. GPS or no GPS, this thing will work. Downtime or no downtime, this thing will work. I mean who knows maybe it might be, it might be a solution that is right for the Nigerian market. So bottom line, there are a bunch of guys and girls who are running around Nigeria right now trying to raise venture, trying to collect millions of dollars because they're trying to solve problems and that we have pressing problems that we have in the financial space.

So there is one problem that these people are going to face and that problem is the problem of trust because there are a bunch of people who are here in Nigeria who have traditional banks like me. I am straight up traditional bank all the way. My brother, on the other hand, he's based in the UK and there's this new, I don't even know what to call them. Should I say online bank or something? You know, he banks with them and I look at him, I'm like, oh guy,

you're stronger. And you know, Nigerians based in other parts of the world, you know, like America and stuff like that. And they're using online banks. And you know, I, you know, I carry a bomb for you guys as I trust you guys with this whole online banking thing. Because for me, I'm a straight up traditional guy. I use GTB, I use Access, I use Keystone. Yes, I use Keystone. For those of you who think Keystone is dead for now, it's not dead.

I don't know if it's dying or not, But Shah, I use Keystone and these are banks that have physical premises. When I have a problem and this whole online telephone thing is not working, I want to be able to go into a physical building and walk up to a customer service desk and there's somebody that I can shout at. Well, I don't go in there and shout at people, especially now that I'm involved in the sale space. But you get what it is that I'm driving at now.

Lots of people like me in Nigeria who that is what we know, that is what we trust. We can see the building, we can go there. We know that CBN regulates you if there's any problem. We know that our money is not disappearing because we can go and Jack CBN. They said our local, you people, you have oversight over these banks. They're supposed to be insured with NDIC, blah blah, blah. Where's my money? So that is what I trust and that is what loads of Nigerians trust.

So this is going to be a problem that you think tech people are going to face. We have a population that's not too savvy, tech savvy, even those of us who are tech savvy gone like me, I'm still not trusting any online thing. Now online banks, now you know all these banks that what you have is a website and maybe a phone number, but physical office, there's no physical office in Lagos and Abuja that I can run to and Jack somebody.

So there are a bunch of us who are not playing that game now. Maybe in the future maybe. So the problem that you guys have to face in the fintech space, especially if you're selling solutions that interface directly with the public, is you guys are going to have to find ways to build trust. Now on a personal level, trust is built many number of ways the different frameworks that we have explored before on the podcast.

But I'm going to use my personal favorite. The reason why it's my personal favorite is not because it is the most effective, it is just because it is easy to remember and remember I keep telling you guys on the podcast, if you stick with what is easy to remember, you can implement it even if they wake you up from your sleep. Now now because they wake you up from your sleep, it's in your head. You can just roll with it if we're going to come up with systems that before we implement.

So excuse me, we need to open our phone, we need to check an app, we need to consult our notes or we need to call somebody. That's not, it's not the way forward. A lot of us, especially at this small stage, we need to have these frameworks at the back of our heads. So that is the reason why I prioritize things that are easy to remember. Now, what I'm referring to, the framework for trust is Tom Hopkins. He says that trust can be built.

Oh, by the way, Tom Hopkins is a trainer American real estate space. This is just an example to show how sales principles are universal. So you can learn something in real estate, learn something in hospitality, learn something in wedding photography, and you can transfer those skills, those knowledge to selling solar panels, to selling catfish or to selling charcoal. So it applies. So for Tom Hopkins, his framework for trust is you have to show competence, you have to show credibility, and you have to show some commonality.

What this means is this. People are not going to do business with you unless you seem competent. That means you have to know what it is you're talking about. If you look like you're a fool and you sound like you're a fool, nobody's going to do business with you. So they build trust. Don't look like a fool, don't sound like a fool. So, So, excuse me. So that's why Tom Hopkins, you know, has that whole thing about appropriate dressing and sorry,

appropriate dressing and appropriate what's the word? Greeting. Because if you show up inappropriate, you just say this young man is an idiot or this girl is a dance and don't pay attention to you if you show up looking correct. But then when you open your mouth, it doesn't show that you know your onions. Then they'll say, look, this young man is an idiot, this girl doesn't know what she's talking about. And then you've lost.

So competence, really important. We have to show that we are competent. Credibility. OK, how do I put it? OK, well, they're quite similar, but let's just say competencies. You know what you're talking about. Credibility means you can do what you say that you can do because there are some people that when you see them, the packaging is on point. When they open their mouth, they say all the right things, but then there's just something that is nagging at the back of your mind and that is our credibility factor.

Like this boy, this girl, they look on point when they talk, sounds like they know what they're saying, but I'm not sure if this person can back up all this talk. So credibility. Need to look for ways to bolster competence, bolster credibility, then this commonality. Commonality is when people think we have some common interests, some When someone thinks you're like me, then it helps. There's a debate about how essential commonality is, but I'm not going to join that debate over whether you should be likable and approachable and or not.

I'm not going to join in that whole debate. But some element of these things are required, so they build trust in the sales process. When we're talking to one individual person because they're trying to win their account, then we need to be appear competent, need to appear credible and we need to have some commonality, establish some commonality. Commonality can be established in different ways. Like I went to OEU, you also you went to OEU or we're both members of redeemed church.

Or by the way, I'm not a member of redeemed church. I'm Catholic. I'm just saying like if you're redeemed person and you get there, the person is playing daddy Jio, you know you guys can have that small conversation about how, Oh yeah, like you love daddy Jio, have you listened to the sermon? I like this sermon on blah blah blah. You know that whole thing, you just have that small talk, 2-3 minutes, you build some commonality, then you can rush into business like, OK,

Deaconess, the reason why I came here today is not to discuss that. Did you actually, we have this product that helps people solve blah blah blah blah, blah. I wanted to see if you're interested. Honestly, if you can invest, you know, so that's the scope then. I'm not going to go into more detail in this because I already have podcast episodes dedicated to that. So just Scroll down the podcast episodes. We have over 810 podcast episodes so far.

Anything that has competence, credibility or commonality in the title or that has Tom Hopkins in the title, that's hop, HOP and then Kins or anything that has trust in the title. We're going to this in more detail. Then to build trust, we also need to have a proper understanding of customers needs because right now we're talking money. If people don't get the sense like you understand them or you guys are jiving or you know what it is that they're trying to solve, then they're not going to end up doing business with you.

There's some people who want to double their money. If they don't think that you understand that they want to double their money and you're not coming up with a plan that shows that you can double their money, then they're not going to go with you. By the way, I don't think doubling your money is a realistic financial expectation to have when you're talking with people who are trying to sell you financial products. So if people are coming to you so they can double your money, I

think you should calm down, Look at the paperwork, discuss one or two people before you start doing business. All these people who say give me one million today, I will give you 1.5 next week, so do your due diligence. So what I was just trying to stress actually was understand customer needs. Show that you understand the customer needs. The reason why that is important is because it's when you understand people's needs that you can demonstrate that is your app, your blockchain, your web three, your fintech, your whatever can solve these personal solutions.

It's only when you understand that you can show that this thing is going to help you do this, help you do this, you can meet your solutions. So if you're able to demonstrate all those things, you should be able to build a certain measure of trust. But there's one more thing we have to pay attention to. Remember that I said a bunch of us in Nigeria are already doing traditional banking. A bunch of us are already satisfied with our traditional banks.

So there's something you have to deal with, which is called switching costs. That is, people already married to their providers. So me and Axis Bank, for better or worse, were married. Me. Axis Bank, GT Bank and Keystone Bank. Yes, I know that some of you who think Keystone is dead and is dying, well, any I don't know about that. It's nice if I have much money with them anyway. So. But The thing is, for better or worse, I'm married to these banks.

If you're trying to get me to leave these banks, I have to start using OPI or Paga or Okino. Paga is not a bank. Packers Payment solutions. OPA is a bank online bank. But if you're trying to get me to leave these things and do some online banking thing or some blockchain, something, something, whatever, that is more secure than banks, there's the whole thing of switching costs. I have to go and close down these my accounts and I have to transfer the money to your own account.

How can you make these things seamless and smooth? Because switching costs sometimes just spoils the whole thing. For instance, I was trying to get on an app, and they're called a quick. Is it quick something? I can't remember what it's called, but there's nothing to it's a way for content creators to be able to find new audiences. So we got to the onboarding stage. And man, this onboarding was just like too much of A hassle.

So I did the first set, you know, name, e-mail address, profile picture. What's your podcast is about? You know, I did everything, but when it came to the podcast uploading thing, now it was just Wahala. I tried the first time. Failed. I tried again. It failed. Somebody from customer care called. We tried to do it together. He failed. It looks like there was a problem with whether I was using it from my phone or which browser or something like that.

After a while I just gave up. I'm like, well, you know what? I promote my podcasts on LinkedIn. I promote them on WhatsApp. So far seems to be working fine. Let me just actually this thing. So there is a switching cost. We need to smoothen out all these switching costs in order to on board people properly and get them using our solution. So on a personal level, if you want to build trust when you're having a conversation with Deaconess Akberu or with Ala Haji Garba, we need to show that you're competent.

You need to build some commonality. Ensure that you're credible. Make sure you understand what deaconess Akubiro wants to achieve with our banking needs or with our financing needs. Then you need to be able to demonstrate to Alhaji Garba that Alhaji with everything you've said so far, this app, this fintech, this blockchain, this Web three, this, whatever that we're doing, this is how it's going to help you achieve the solutions better than what you are getting right now at GTB or at Access Bank.

Then you also need to make sure that the whole switching costing is going to be smooth. It should be easy for Dickens, Akubiru and Al Haji Garba to set up their accounts to transfer the funds. Everything you just move smooth. Any friction that you put there will minimize your chance of closing the sale and will build will reduce trust in the system. So that's on a personal level, but you can take boys and girls. You are not always going to be dealing with people on a personal level.

And in fact you might be trying to build mass marketplace adoption. So you should be trying to build trust and acceptance across a broad base and across mass marketing. So that actually be your challenge. So to achieve that, what you need to do is you need to clearly explain the problem that your fintech solves in your mass media, in your podcasts, in the emails you send out, in the content marketing. When your CEO appears or your founder appears on Radio Nigeria or Cool FM or whatever, you need to be able to explain clearly the problems that you solve.

Because the mistake that you people have been making in different tech spaces. You guys have been doing plenty of influencer marketing. And influencer marketing is not bad. But The thing is, all these fancy billboards, because I tried cheaper, that's all to transfer money to the UK. You know my brother is in the UK so I need to see if I can send money and if he can send back just to see if at least the thing works. That's back when we're thinking about ways of monetizing the podcast and we're unable to to to get it to work.

But The thing is the cheaper them, you know they were using influencer marketing so those billboards of with Burner Boy and other musicians and then things like that. So this influencer marketing is actually not a it's not a bad thing, but The thing is just putting up billboards of Burner Boy and was that girl. I can't remember her name. She's with Maven, so you know that Maven starlet and the rest of them, it's not really the way.

I mean, it's it's OK, it's it's good. These are popular faces. But the problem is you're not explaining to the Nigerians like, what does your fintech do? What does cheaper do? So instead of doing cheaper and then boner boys face, how about cheaper boner boys face But then minimize boner boys face. Don't make it so big that it swallows the whole board and then maybe just as clearly, send money. Send money to your children in the UK or receive money from your children abroad or something like that.

You know, I'm not an advertising person, but you get the whole idea. So it's not just influencer marketing, but you should be clearly explaining to Nigerians what does your fintech, what does your whatever do? Because there's competition. You guys are launching these things every six months there's a new something. So like cheaper is no longer raining. I've started hearing some other names. These things are coming up all the time, but you guys are just advertising in all the right places.

But you are not saying what it is that you do. What problem are you solving now? Before all these people came up, remember. Is it something something money transfer? I can't remember what it's called that they have a white logo and they used to walk through Aussie Union Bank. All their messaging was very clear. Send money to your children abroad. It was that simple. Therefore those of us who are in the Ek, sorry. In the UK the messaging was very simple, was very simple.

Send money to your dependence in Nigeria. Very, very, very clear messaging. Your messaging should be clear and explain what problem you are solving. Then you guys should also be highlighting regulation and compliance. That is something you would not do in the Fintech space. You guys do not say we are regulated by CBN or our deposits are insured by NDIC. The CBN is the Central Bank of Nigeria. If you say we are regulated by CBN, this is where we registered something.

Some Nigerians will calm down and their mind will be at peace because people don't want to lose deposits. I have not lost deposits, but from when back when my father was alive, back when I was a kid up until now, I know people who have lost deposits when banks have gone under in Nigeria. It is a very, very, very credible fear that you guys need to be addressing. So be highlighting. We are registered by CBN. Our money is insured by NDICI.

Think NDIC is Nigerian Deposits Insurance Corporation something like that. Because people don't want to lose their deposits. And you fintech people, you boys people are boys and girls are running all over the place talking. Web three is the future blockchain, blah blah blah blah blah. Yes, whoever is the future Blockchain is wonderful here. We get it. It's magic. But The thing is, everyday ordinary people like me, and in fact forget about me, think about my uncles and aunties.

They don't care about all these things when they're worried about losing money. So please include as part of your messaging. We are regulated by or we are registered with so that people just know that, OK, if I drop money in this online thing, money, you know your money is not going to disappear. Plus, it doesn't help that last month, I can't remember the name of one of these fintechs that had an online microfinance license.

So a microfinance license. And it was an online bank. And they're holding customers money. People are not able to withdraw. The excuse that they were given in social media is that they were not able to raise another round of financing. These things do not enshrine trust in people like me. Like people are hoping to be your customers. You're supposed to be a bank. Deposits are supposed to be insured. You people are supposed to have ratios.

How can you tell me that the reason why you are not giving me my money is because you, Mr. Founder, Madam Founder, you are not able to raise funds from investors. It doesn't fly. Doesn't make sense. It doesn't help people like me to trust you guys, which is the reason why when I hear that somebody has done an online banking thing, I'm like, man, I respect you. But for me, I'm sticking to Axis Bank where I can go in and shout at somebody.

I'm sticking to Keystone Bank. I know where the addresses are in Abuja and I can drive there and I can talk to someone. So people should be addressing evil, should be showing in your marketing communications. You're registered with CBN, you have license from blah blah blah. Your funds are insured with NDIC. The whole point of all these things is you're just trying to show Nigerians we're not going to lose your money. Then you also have to be educating people on security protocols.

So yes, talk about your encryption, talk about multi factor authentication, talk about fraud detection. But remember what I said two days ago when you're talking about these things, use simple languages and talk about benefits and not features. Because not everybody understands what encryption means. Not everybody understands what multi factor authentication means or what fraud detection means. So use simple languages.

For instance, one of my aunties asked me this thing that they saw on WhatsApp. They say WhatsApp is something, something message level encryption, blah blah blah blah blah. She asked me what does this thing means and I explained to her, oh auntie, this is what it means. It means that the only people who can read your message are you holding this phone, the other person that you sent the message to, Nobody in between can use any kind of use any kind of technology and read your message.

Now in Nigeria that's a thing, because we know that during the military era there were people like civil society or people who are civil society organizers, people who had their phones hacked. There was a thing that anyway, let me not go too much into all that. But in Nigeria we know that phones can be hacked. So when you say encryption, it just means that there is no hacking in between. It is just you holding this phone, the other person holding that phone.

So, so long as Auntie you don't give your phone to anybody else, you're safe. Uncle that you send the message to on the other end, so long as he doesn't give that phone to anybody else, both of you are safe. Nobody in between. These are the kind of simple terms that we should be talking about when you're trying to educate people through mass media and through social media. So instead of saying standard ISO something something encryption services explain it in those terms.

Nobody on this earth can hack your messages. The only person that will see your message or see your account banners is God. Apart from God, nobody else can get into the system. You should be talking in simple, plain terms. Then I already gave some ideas about how you can talk about multi factor authentication in the episode that we did I think maybe two days ago. So yes, talk about these things. How are you securing people's money, How are you securing their bank records, things like that.

Then also if you partner with trusted institutions in Nigeria, it will help. It also has another benefit because you can use their networks and gain access to their own customer base and use that to grow your business. For instance, there's a Fintech in Nigeria that has been used to administer government grants. You know, every time a government comes in, it's not giving our grants and all that. So there's a new round going around and there's one that is partnering with this bank.

I can't remember what they're called, but their logo is like red and it has maybe like an S in it. Is it red? Well, anyway, bottom line is they're partnering with Nigerian banks, which is a smart thing because they're going to be getting access to the bank's customer base. So the government funds that are being paid out right now are going to be paid out using that particular app. One of my guys is a photographer. He's been trying to access the thing, so he brought the app to me to show me.

But the thing was kind of glitchy. The app was not running, logging in was a problem. So that's also one thing you fintech people please. Your ideas are brilliant, but make sure that product development has been sorted. When people download the app, it should be running because these things damage trust. You go through all the hassle. You get all the licenses, you partner with the bank, you guys roll out the app, billions of Nigerians download it, and let's say 1,000,000 Nigerians download it.

Out of the 1,000,000, let's say 300,000. Have problems with using the app? You know as well of course on Google Apps they will give you the stars accordingly. Trust is now being damaged when we partner with trusted institutions. Then also you guys should be promoting user testimonials and case studies. So for like the UK online banks, if I was in the UKI, guess I wouldn't have a problem because they're showing testimonials and case studies and things like that.

Plus, you know, I've seen that OK, my brother's money has not lost so far in the last four years that he's been with that bank. I guess it kind of makes people soften up. So promote testimonials, These things help. In fact, me, I only started taking OPA seriously when I noticed that in Cowra Bank and sorry, not Cowra Bank. Cowra market in Abuja is one of these local markets. When I noticed that traders, it's like all of them have OPA

accounts. OPA POS now. OK, people are using it. People are speaking highly of it. All right, I guess it's OK Who knows, maybe one day I might have an OPA bank account. So promote testimonials, use case studies, do this on social media and mass media. And then another thing, fintech boys and girls, you will need to be very transparent about your fees and terms of service because people don't like this whole thing of vanishing fees.

Remember I said OK, let me try one of these online things? So I did the account, I put my money there and then next thing was it like 2K just disappeared. I said what happened to the 2K? Well first of all there's no brag match I can go to complain to. There's no phone number, so you just e-mail, then e-mail back and forth. They're not responding on time. It turns out it's some holding charge or something or whatever, whatever, whatever.

These things don't inspire people with confidence. So you need to be able to tell people upfront that when you download this app, when you sign up on this website, when you create this bank account, this is what is going to happen. First of all, we will deduct 2000 from your account because we're trying to test this, this, this and that, that, that When it is done, we will return the 2000 era back to you. This is something that you have to be very clear about.

And then not just this whole anyway, you get the picture, Make sure people know what's up. It should be very clear before people sign up and don't just say it's in the terms and terms of service and blah blah, blah. Let's face it, it's not even Nigerians, even Americans are UK people. I don't know anybody who reads terms of service before they sign up for something, so let it be there on the website. Final step, there should be a notice there.

When you're done with this and you transfer the whatever, we shall deduct 2000 naira because we're trying to test that and that when you're done, the 2000 will be returned to you on or before 3 working days or three banking days. Let the thing be clear. So let them know how much are you taking for ATM card, how much are you deducting for this, deducting for this, deducting for that. Now remember we're talking about trust here.

These are going to be long term campaigns, whether it's social media or mass media. Trust is not going to build in a few short weeks. How long is it going to to last? I don't know, ask marketing specialist, advertising specialist, but don't ask me because for me what I know is sales and one-on-one conversations. So this market mass marketing thing is not really my cup of tea, but if you do these things that we're spoken about on a mass market level and on an individual level, you should be taking, you should be one step closer to getting people to trust your your solution.

So that's it. Thank you very much for your time and attention. Connect with me on WhatsApp. The phone number is 08064662140. The country code is +234. Then on WhatsApp. Sorry no, that's WhatsApp. LinkedIn. My name is Tavishima Ayedi. I'm the host of the show. You can confirm the spelling of my name from the link We're currently listening to this episode. If you'd like a shout out, just let me know. And please also make sure that all your details are there because there are some people who follow me and who say what's up, but they don't respond to my messages.

So I just know that, OK, you follow that your name is Lucy, but I don't know where you're at, what you're based, what business you do, you know, things like that. So I can't really shout you out. So yeah, so that's it. So thanks for your time and attention. I'll catch you guys at the next episode.