Kicks & Conversions: Building a Sales Process for Your Nigerian Streetwear Brand

Hello and welcome to the show. Today is the second part of a two-part series. So if this is your first time of listening to the podcast after you're done listening to this, then skip back one episode, listen to that. That's the one that comes immediately prior. And you'll get the context of what this case study is, because the prior episode was about how we can create a winning sales process all the way from lead generation all the way down to the close.

So some of the ideas that we discussed were what a sales process should be, what a lead is, or rather who a lead is, things that we need to think about when we are coming up with our ideal customer profile, ways to start conversations, you know, those sorts of things. So after you're done listening to this episode, for the fuller context, skip back, listen to that, and you're going to get caught up to speed. So like I promised in yesterday's episode, today we're going to look at a fictional case study and we're going to call the female entrepreneur.

We're going to call her Priya. Now forgive me if this is not a female name, but I think one of my classmates was named Priya when I was growing up, so I'll just use the name Priya. But if you're from the Niger Delta region and you don't think you know that's a female name, then you know, write me later on and apologies. So like I mentioned in the previous episode, the reason why I'm using Priya as a case study is because I'm currently having a chat with someone was supposed to have a conversation much later on.

This one is not going to be business related, it's just OK, well it's business related, but I'm not trying to get this person as a potential client for sales, coaching or consultancy services. It's just that she currently sells sneakers and I thought it was a male dominated industry. And plus, I also assume that people who are sneaker heads were probably my age or older, and I didn't think that there was a demographic for that still existing in Nigeria.

So I just found it really interesting that you have a Nigerian female who is getting into this line of business. And I just thought it was rather interesting. So I'll be having a chat with her and when I find out more about her business, I'll make a podcast episode about that. But in the meantime, this is my own fictional case study. Assuming I was a female named Pre, perhaps this is how I would go about it, creating a winning sales process all the way from lead generation down to the close.

Now, like I said, I'm not involved in this business. I think it's really interesting. So me here with this fictional case study is me just freestyling and make making up a bunch of stuff. But I trust that you guys will see not even if I make any mistakes along the way. Like for instance if I get the ideal customer profile wrong. Eventually when I speak to the real life lady who is in the business you'll see that my thought process is sound.

And that's the reason why I keep insisting time and time again over on the podcast that what we should be focusing on is creating a is creating a well thought out sales process. If you're process oriented, you have something to guide you through. Initiating conversations with people, building relationships, trying to close so you can do things sustainably, repeatedly. You can do that over time you'll be able to refine it, take feedback.

It really is just the best way to go about it. Rather than waking up today and thinking today I'm going to live my best life, you motivate yourself, you read some scripture, you look in the mirror, you say some words of affirmation and then you try and motivate yourself to make a sale today. So just think, process oriented, come up with a process, a wealth on our process, follow it every day. And then over time it's just a law of probability.

Over time the results will start coming in. So Priya, that's the name of our female entrepreneur and let's say she's passionate about sneakers and St. wear culture. Because I'm assuming that if you're going to be involved in this kind of business, you have to be passionate or interested in it. Because truth be told, I don't even like wearing shoes and it's one of the problems I had with being a a law student at 1st and then later on a lawyer because we have to wear formal shoes.

So I don't like any kind of shoes at all. I prefer to wear palm slippers and sandals, trackers and those sorts of things, so I doubt I would be a very good salesperson. It was to come to sneakers and stuff like that. So Priya, she's passionate about sneakers and St. Wear culture, and she wants to launch an online store. Now, I could have thought about her doing the business without the whole online thing, but I've been at a number of sessions where I'm speaking to people,

and some people have pointed out that a lot of the examples that I give just kind of, well, one lady in particular, she's in the beauty and in the online space, she told me point blank that a lot of my examples and a lot of my assumptions just assume that I'm dealing with people who are doing stuff face to face in real life, in real time. But there's a whole class, there's a whole cater of Nigerians that are doing business exclusively online.

And she thought it would be nice if I pay attention to those people every now and then. And yes, of course it makes sense. So today I'm going to assume that Priya is doing her thing exclusively online. But you will find that as we go along with this case study, you'll see that my philosophy about business conversations is going to permeate the whole thing. Because when you're live direct and face to face, it's kind of hard for you to forget that you are in a conversation with someone because someone is over there looking right back at you.

But then our brothers and sisters who do things exclusively online sometimes forget that they are in a conversation or that they should be having a conversation. And so they end up copying and pasting at people or broadcasting at people or dictating to people. I mean, you get where I'm coming from because you have a phone, it's a screen or a tablet or a keyboard and you're typing. It's easy to just copy paste, copy paste, copy paste, send.

And you have sent to 20 people so they forgot. They forget that they should be in a conversation. So Priya is doing this thing online and let's say her online store is going to be called Priya's Goats. Now, when I say goats, I don't mean goat like EO as in meet, but GOAT the greatest of all time. So because I know that, at least during my time anyway, sneaker heads back when I was in primary school were all about Jordans.

Those Jordans, Air Force ones, Nikes, you know, stuff like that. And at the time, Jordan was supposed to be the GOAT, was supposed to be the greatest of all time. Now there's this argument about whether Michael Jordan is the greatest of all times or whether LeBron is the greatest of all times. And some people want to put Kobe Bryant's name over there as the greatest of all time as well. So I'm not a sports guy. I'm not a sports nerd, so I

don't know much about these things. But anyway, that's where I just got the acronym from. I'm greatest of all time because I know that for sneaker heads, those debates are not trivial. They matter. There's some people who will die on, look, it's Jordan or nothing. And there's some people who are going to say Jordan is 30 years ago, it is LeBron James who is the King. And some people will say that, look, forget it, Brant is no more.

But for the time that he was with us, these were his stats, this is how he performed and blah, blah, blah. So he's the greatest of all time. So some of these things might sound like rubbish to you, but if you are in that world, basketball, sneakers, St. culture, hip hop, things like that, these things matter. Who is the greatest rapper of all times? Who is the greatest music producer of all times? Who's the greatest basketball player of all times?

You know, you don't hear people who are golf aficionados, you don't hear golfers talking about who's the greatest of all times. So this good thing, it's a street wear sneaker, hip hop lifestyle kind of thing. So the online store is Priya's goats might not make sense to you but I've picked a name that I think should make sense to people who are involved in the sneaker, the street where the hip hop culture, you know, that kind of lifestyle.

And so let's say that Now is online but she's focusing on limited edition sneakers in Niger. Now the reason why I picked limited edition sneakers is because if you want to find Adidas, you know Niger has opened up. Now it's not like back when I was in primary school, so Niger has really opened up. So if you want to find Adidas, you can find it. You just, you know, if you're, I'm assuming if you're in Lagos, if you're in Abuja, even in some parts in the east, maybe like in Port Harcourt, you can go to town, you will find your Adidas,

you can find your Puma, you can find your Nike, you know, things like that. But it might be hard to find correct limited edition Air Jordans. Look, I know that, you know things have moved beyond Air Jordan, but, you know, forgive me. During my time in primary school, everybody was Air Force One or Air Jordans or no, this Adidas something, Was it Puma? And I can't remember. So for those of you who are into the culture now, I know you'll be laughing at me like this Papillo is talking about stuff that faded out 30 years ago, but just forgive me, you know?

That's all I know. So if you're looking for limited edition stuff, you want to find the correct stuff. You want to find the current LeBron whatever or the current Jordan whatever, because they still keep making the Jordan editions. If you want to find the real deal, you know it's going to be hard in Niger because you know, Nigeria is not like the UK or America, where there's a steady market for these kinds of things. Because these people go crazy.

Like if they announced that they're going to release a limited edition, blah blah, blah. Only 50 in 2024 is going to drop today on April 1st or something. That boys, girls that will go and sleep outside the store and queue because they want to be the first person that went to the store and buy and you know, take pictures and you know, like it was me, like I'm the one who got the first, the authentic, the whatever, and then there's a market for it.

So some people take these sneakers, maybe they can buy it. I'm just guessing by the way. Let me just make it up. So it's probably you can buy this thing maybe like 500 lbs or something or $500, you take it and keep it, but then because it's huge demand you buy it at 500 and maybe you sell it at you know 5000. So it happens. Now, since there's not a that kind of market is not here in Niger, it will be hard to find limited edition sneakers in Niger.

That's my guess. I'm guessing though. So if it turns out that my guess is wrong, you know, don't blame me by me. That's business and sales for you. You have a hypothesis, you go into the market, you test it either right or you're wrong. If you're right, cool, you move forward. If you're wrong, then you tweak your idea and take another stab at it. OK? Where was I? OK, so praise God I should doing limited edition sneakers in Niger because Niger is hard to find.

So she should be able to make a good profit, make a good killing. Because after all it's not guys like me who are going to buy those sneakers. These people who know what's up, people who are in the culture, people who value this thing and people who are willing to pay above and beyond because they know that if you go to Whooser market you find Nikes. If you go to Allen Ave. he catcher you find Nikes. But if you want to get this premium edition blah blah blah that they only made 2020

versions of in the year 2023. If you want to get that thing then you have to go through people like pre all these online sticker heads on people. So yesterday I said one thing that we have to do is to define our ICP. The ICP being the ideal customer profile, or the customer avatar as people like to say it, or your best case customer. But the whole idea behind it is this. Before you start trying to sell or to market anything, you need to figure who am I chasing?

Who am I pursuing? Because if you don't decide who is the best person to pursue, you just enter the market and you'll be running up and down, left and right chasing all kinds of people. And inevitably you will spend time talking to people that you shouldn't have been talking to in the 1st place because it's a waste of time. There's no way the person is going to buy If you're about to start this Prius go to business and you don't define your ICP,

you might end up spending 45 minutes with me trying to convince me that I should drop my money and buy Michael Jordan sneakers. I mean, you might look at me, you guess my age. You think, OK, this guy Papillo. So Michael Jordan let me try and sell him Michael Jordan's. You might be trying to tell me that should buy Michael Jordan's for 150K, but I'm not going to budget because I'm not part of the ideal customer profile.

I'm not a hip hop person. I'm on the street wear. I'm not a part of the culture. I don't value those things. You tell me 150 K in my mind I'm thinking 150K. Meanwhile I have school fees to pay or I have to buy Internet or I have to go to the mechanic. Or if I take down 150, Ki can go and buy, you know, four or five pair of shoes for myself. OK, maybe not four or five because guy shoes have become expensive, but you get my point.

So you spend time talking to somebody like me or maybe talking to my wife, and my wife is definitely not in the whole street head kind of thing. You'll be wasting your time. And that is where people lose lots of time and money and get motivated. And they say that sales is hard, sales is not hard. Well, OK, well, it's hard, but it can be easier if you're talking to the right people. There's no way somebody like me is going to buy it because I'm not part of the ICP.

So that's your number one. If you're starting this Prius, go to business. You sit down, you, your business partner, your spouse, your investors, whatever, You guys sit down and you now say, OK, who should we be pursuing in the beginning? Self. Who is our ICP? Who is the customer avatar, Who is the person we should be running after? Now remember, like I said, when it comes to business and sales, usually we're doing lots of guess work.

Guess work is not a problem. You guess, you enter into the market, the market will give you feedback. You take that feedback and then you refine. So if you assume that anybody who was born between 1978 and 1985 is your ideal customer profile and you go, you run into people like me, you run to people like my wife, you run people like my cousins who don't give a hood about these sorts of things. You come back and say, you know what, it's not just anybody who that was born between 1975 and 1985, but it also has to be people who are interested in blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

You refine, you go back into the market, you try again, you get feedback. So that's how it works. So right now, let me guess. So my own guess is that sneakerheads will be young men and women because I understand that women have now joined the the market for kicks because I see some young girls walking around with, you know, correct. You know, as in you see the sneakers and like, wow, OK, impressive. Not bad. So I now know that girls wear kicks these days while he's back when during my own day, you know, some people used to call them kicks.

I don't know, you call them now. So, so let's say people between 18 to 35. But let's just stretch it to 45 so that people like me and my cousins can also fall in there. Because I know that there's some old men who, when I say old men, I mean, you know, like those of you who are 50. I know that there's some old men who wear that kind of stuff. Like, I saw a picture of Busta Rhymes on Facebook recently and he was still decked out in the gold chains and everything.

And I'm thinking that Busta Rhymes you don't know you're Baba. Now, as in look at Dre. You know Dre doesn't wear chains and everything. Dre is now jeans and T-shirt 'cause you know, you have to grow up now. But anyway, I'm not judging those people. So you're 50 year old, dude, and you like to wear kicks. You like to wear limited edition sneakers and no island? No problem. I'm not judging, but I'm kind of judging. So my guess is 18 to 35, maybe 45.

Then my guess is also these people have to be active on social media because that's the only way that they're going to be able to get the gist about the drop. You know, when are they releasing this new Michael Jordan edition or when are they releasing this new Kobe? OK, no, the Kobe Bryant have any sneakers? And let me just guess. So that's when they're releasing the new Kobe Bryant. So when they're releasing the new whoever so active on social media.

And my guess is people who follow sneaker influencers. Now this is your ICP and remember, we're talking about this business being done online. When you are ready to start doing Facebook advertisements, Google advertisements, tick tock advertisements, you now have a greater idea about who to target. So instead of just sending mess adverts to the Internet like that, just wide, everybody brah. I see the advert, my mom sees the advert, my auntie sees the advert.

You narrow it down, You tighten it this way, 18 to 45. Mom C will not see it. And chances are, Mom C is probably not as my mom. I mean, it's probably not a sneaker head. My mother-in-law will not see your advert. Chances are my Mom C is not a sneaker head then, since you're also trying to put in people who follow sneaker audiences. Sorry, sneaker influencers. Then you're going to be able to put on Facebook, you can put this look alike audiences or something like that.

You know, I don't really do advertise. I don't know that I don't really. I did adverts on Instagram a while ago for my waiting photography business, but that was a long time ago like this over 10 years ago. So if you want to dive into this space, you have to look for somebody who this is their specialty online advertising. But back then you could do look alike audiences, so people who follow this kind of person or people who watches this kind of content, people who are interested in so and so you'd be able to put it in the advertisements.

So since this is part of your I, your ICP, when you're running your online ads, you'll be able to put in all these data, 18 to 45 active on this platform, this platform and people who follow this influencer or who are interested in this, this and that and that. So we need to get ICP locked down so you can see how from the beginning now you're going to start saving money because you're running after the right person. If you create a general advertisement on Instagram or LinkedIn or Tiktok, but you're targeting the whole world, you will spend money.

But if you narrow it down, you tell Facebook, Facebook or this advert that I'm putting out, only show it to people who are between 18 and 35 and who are only interested in this and this and this and that and who only follow these people, these people, that people then you have, you have a greater chance that the right people will see your advertisement. Then yesterday we also spoke about lead generation strategies. Now remember that a lead from what I defined yesterday is anybody who has done something in the past that gives you reason to believe that they might be your potential customer today.

So they may have, they must have done something yesterday, the day before last year. That gives you a hint that these people might be interested. So lead generation strategies basically is you're coming up with strategies. You just get people to show their hand. To just get people to say I am interested, I might be interested. So you can put up stuff on Instagram and Tiktok showing new sneakers. You put up videos, OK, this one just launched.

It is the Kobe Bryant X500, blah blah blah blah blah. You make a video, people comment under it. People will like people. Whatever people comment, some people will send you DM. You can see that these people are showing their hand. These are some of the people that might be interested. So for somebody like me who I see the video, but I don't comment, I don't like, I don't share, I don't DM you, you have no reason to believe that I I'm a lead 'cause I have not showed my hand, I have not done something now or in the past to say I might be interested.

So that's why this kind of content really, really important. Now, in times past on the podcast, I've spoken about this lady who also sell sells sneakers, but she's sorry, excuse me. So I'm getting over the cold, 'cause my son had came down with something. So yeah, as usual, I picked it up. Oh yeah. So I spoke about a long time ago when the episode that I did about meeting with a visual businesswoman, and we spoke about that whole thing of dancing and twerking on Instagram and Tiktok, whether it makes sense.

Now. The example that I gave was this lady. I think her name is Becky. I might be wrong. I think the name is Becky. And this girl gets on Tiktok and she twerks every day and then she puts the videos up on Instagram. Now when I saw her, I was curious, 'cause I was wondering how would somebody just wake up and be twerking on on social media every day? I was like, no, there must be an angle. So I was watching this thing,

but of course my wife looked at me and she was like, you know, you're a grown man, stop watching this. Whatever. I say, no babies market research, but my wife didn't believe me. That was market research. But of course, between you and I, it definitely was market research. I'm not just looking at young girls twerking over the Internet. So after a while, I noticed that even though Becky puts up these videos of her twerking and grinding at the back in the background, sneakers are always in the background.

Boxes are always in the background. You know, stuff like that. So I now started reading the comments and I saw that lots of people who watch Becky's videos, first of all, of course, since she's twerking and grinding, they're young boys. And it just happens that amongst those young boys seem to be sneaker heads. So some of the comments were not just about how she's winding and grinding, but at the back, did you see that Kanye something,

something, something that dropped last week? So basically, I was trying to show those Abuja business women that look twerking and grinding. First of all, I don't recommend it. You don't have to, But people who twerk and grind is because they have a sales process that is set up to maximize that kind of attention and to maximize profits at the end. So this lady, Becky, she's twerking and grinding, but young boys are watching.

Their blood is getting hot. They also happen to be sneaker heads, so you don't want to purchase the purchase through her. She now charges a premium for delivering it to people. In fact, she can deliver to you and then take your video and then stuff like that. And of course, you know it's Rep now and that's by your young boy and she makes a video, she showed up by the house to deliver the shoes, you know, blah blah, blah.

So it's kind of Rep, you know, if your delivery video gets on her page. So it's a big deal. And of course she charged the premium for that. So imagine her selling shoes for, let me guess, maybe like $2000 or something and then she charges you maybe the $800 extra for her to deliver it to your house live and then of course you'll do the selfie thing and then all that. So that's our own business model as how it works. So just a a recap that's in case there any of you young women who are watching this thing and who are thinking this whole dancing thing, Should I be dancing and pointing?

Should I be twerking and grinding? You don't have to, but for people who do it, there is a plan. So if you decide that you must point or dance or grind or twerk, my advice is to go and learn from people like this, Becky and other people and try and just learn the game from them because it's a system. They don't just wake up every day raw powder, dress, wear clothes and then dance because they have nothing to do. Everybody has school with school fees to pay, everybody has rent to pay, everybody has stuff that want to do with their life.

So all these people twerking and grinding, you know, it's it's not just for, it's not just for giggles, you know? Anyway, sorry for this. Going off on the tangent. OK, basically I was just trying to say that Instagram, Tiktok, those sorts of things, show the new sneakers however you choose to do it. So Becky does a grinding, but you don't have to. Then you can also partner with influencers. You can also write blog posts and articles about sneaker culture or things like that.

Now remember this is lead generation strategies. The whole idea is you're trying to get people to tip their hand. Try to show that I might be interested. People like me who watch the video and leave just, you know, ignore us, because there's some things that show, I think on WhatsApp you can see people who watched but who didn't do anything. So if you're on one of those platforms, you can see that people watched. Ignore the watchers.

People who watched and liked. That's something. People who watched and liked and commented, that is something. People who liked and watched and commented and then sent you Adm. Those are even stronger signals. Somebody who liked and watched and commented and sent you Adm sent you a text message and now the person is calling. Can you guys see what I'm talking about? Lead generation, how you qualify or rather how you score leads.

The person who went through all these processes, I still called you at the end of the day. Now this is a hot lead. The person has done 2345 things to show that I might be interested. That is the person you should be spending time with, not the person that watched and left or maybe watched and only liked. OK, so these are some of the things that you can do to get people to show their interest, to show their hand. If you're doing this online store, previous goods you're selling, St.

Wear and sneakers. Now I'm only talking online because like I was told at the Abuja Business Ladies meeting, I was told I usually ignore online people. So today I'm making all about them. So when you're doing lead generation strategies, you're looking for people who engage. That is why there's also this thing called the lead magnet. The lead magnet is something that you put out a freebie. You're trying to get. People basically drop their contact details.

So if you make this video, let me see, OK, make this video. You said the Kobe Bryant XYZ 5000 in memory of Kobe Drops today. Starting price is 150,000 naira. If you want to be put in a raffle drawer to be able to qualify to win a free whatever, comment under this video and drop your phone number. Now a bunch of people will do that. You see, now that is a lead. That is a lead. OK, well, that's not really a lead magnet.

That's more like a a a raffle or something or a lucky draw. But you get my point. The people who drop phone numbers, those are good leads. Do your raffle, announce a winner. But from all those phone numbers, you can hit those people up and have conversations with them. I noticed that you dropped your phone number to win a something, something, something. Sorry you didn't win, but they're releasing a new line of Kobe blah blah blah blah blah is not as limited edition as this one.

Would you be interested in having a look when the thing comes out? Some people will say no. Some people will ignore. Ignore those people while looking for people who are engaging. The people who say yes, very good. Take those numbers, those phone numbers, put them in a separate book or something. When the thing launches you will now call those people specially there you bro sister. How far now? It's me it's Priya remember I

reached out to you 2 weeks ago blah blah blah. Anything has dropped though. Do you wanna have a look? It's limited edition of this one is only 1000 copies. Would you like to have a look now Should IDM you the the link, the whatever, so you guys you see how we're going with this. So that's the whole thing about raffles, lead magnets and all those things. You're trying to give something away for free or the prospects of them winning something so that you can get information,

get somebody's e-mail, get somebody's phone number so that you can reach out to people later on to have much more productive conversations. Now this process of engaging and this process of sorting through contacts, sorting through these phone numbers and the emails that you're going to get from this video or from all the activities you're doing online, this is the process that is called qualification because you're sorting through people,

you're talking to them, learning about them, learning about their taste. You have to learn about their taste, because it's possible that Papillos like me might be interested in the Jordans and the Kanye West, whatever. But then people who are 18 to 20 something might only be interested in LeBron James, you know, stuff like that. So you need to know who it is that you're talking to. This is the whole process of qualification.

You're just sorting through people. So from the traffic gate on the website, this is the process. You put out lead magnets, free offers, stuff like that. Get people's contact details. Social media is the same thing. You're trying to get contact details or you're trying to get people to DM you. You know that whole you know, if you're interested, DM me Now. The people that didn't DM ignore them. The people that DM you know.

This might be serious and you're engaging in qualification. Then whenever we qualify, we're trying to figure out people who are just merely curious because so many like me and my DM just because I'm curious. As per I have not seen an Air Force One since I left secondary school. So I'm just curious, maybe I just want to see, OK, what do they look like now? OK, my best friend Nana, he had one. And let me just see, is it the same kind of thing as Nana?

It's not like I'll see if I want to buy you because there are people like that who respond because they're just curious. So you're trying to figure out all those people out for people who are just curious. You try and put them into a relationship nurturing phase because you might groom the relationship and maybe later on that I want to buy it. So who knows, maybe I came because I was curious. Aspire when were kids, Nana had one.

Maybe Popsy couldn't buy one for me. I was only curious. But maybe now I'm a big boy. I have more money. I saw that shoe I didn't treat myself to when I was a child. Maybe now I want to treat myself to it. Because like after all, why should I carry last? Nana wore Air Force ones myself. I should be able to wear Air Force ones before I die. So you never know. You might be able to get me to buy some shoes on me later on,

then from people who are interested. You're having much more direct sales conversations. Then of course, like I said, you also have to be asking questions about people's style, 'cause you're trying to figure out what are they interested in, you know, things like that. So this process is not as straightforward as some people think, 'cause some people think you create content on Instagram and then you don't blow. So it's not like that.

This is all the stuff that happens in the back. You're engaging with people during live chats, during DMS, during e-mail, during WhatsApp, you know, stuff like that. So this is the hard work that has to be done when it comes to creating a winning sales process all the way from lead generation all the way down to closing a deal. And of course we used a fictional case study pre a street wear sneakers, but the whole process is still the same no matter what business you do,

whether online or offline. Now of course they're going to be more case studies in the future, so we don't have to say everything today. I just want you guys to be able to see how all that theory that we discussed yesterday, how it applies live and direct, you know, to people who are trying to do stuff. Now when I do speak to the lady who's actually the real life lady who's selling sneakers on street wear and I learn all these things from her because it's possible that this is my ICPI think my ICP self is too broad.

I think 18 to 45 is too broad. I think it should be narrower when they when I speak to her, you know I'll get the low down and I'll come share with you guys. So we've done 30 minutes. Let me bring it to a close. Thank you very much for your time and attention. My name is Tavishma Ayede. I'm the host of the show. Please connect with me on LinkedIn. My the correct spelling of my name. You will get that from the link. We're currently listening to this episode.

And also my e-mail address in case e-mail is your thing. But then if you're a WhatsApp person you like to send messages, then I'm available on WhatsApp and Telegram. The number is 08064662140. The country code is +234. For those of you who are not Nigerian, thanks for your time and attention. I'll catch you guys at the next episode.