Stop Killing the Deal: Always End with a CTA

Today on the podcast, we're going to be looking at networking, how to deal with clients, especially if you want to figure out, you know, whether they're happy or not, whether we're doing a satisfactory job, and then also some tidbits about how to introduce yourself. So again, today on the podcast, that's what we're going to be looking at, networking, dealing with clients and how to introduce yourself. Now, the reason why it's a hodgepodge of stuff just thrown together is because it actually is ideas that came up with the conversation that I had with the podcast listener.

So shout out to overcomer or Foribo upon pronouncing your surname right. And by the way, I think your surname is really cool. Overcomer. You know, I like names like that, you know, very positive because you know, I'm team from venue state and in my own place, we have a tradition of naming children that way as well, you know, naming children with aspirations, naming children with prayers. So my own name, Tavi Shima, means how will I put it?

Now, be of be of good courage, be strong, have fortitude, you know, those sorts of things. So, yeah, nice coma, overcoma. So it's our prayer that you overcome every single obstacle that you come across in your personal life and also in business. So these are just some of the general things that Overcomer and I were chatting about on LinkedIn. He's a copywriter. And so I'm sharing the conversation here today and then some of the major themes that we spoke about.

So I'm sure you've been able to figure out, especially since today is a Sunday, that I'm making today's recording outside church because kids are having cactus and classes. So, you know, I'm just chilling here. You know, after that, we'll just have evening Mass and then we'll go home. So yeah, there's going to be some noise in the background, you know, children running around, people having conversations. And there's one idiot who has been blasting his motorcycle all over the place.

So you might hear him just zooming by as in some, some people don't get sense as in no respect whatsoever. Like this is a church. Now I can come and just be blasting your motorcycle everywhere. Just be doing from, from, from, from, from, you know, you know, like it was a must. The guy won't try it. Now if we don't break your head. As in anyway. So yeah, making today's recording outside. Now, if you are tired about hearing business stuff that works in America and UK but doesn't work in Niger, then welcome to the podcast.

This is your jam. I'm your host, my name is Tavishima Agede and for years I've been bringing practical, realistic, relevant stuff that works in the Nigerian market. So if you're tired of generic stuff and you want to grow your business in Nigerian way, then stay tuned into the podcast. Stay locked in and subscribe on Spotify, YouTube, Apple or any player of your choice. And if you'd love to connect, call, send me a text message or a WhatsApp message on 08064662140.

So like I said today, now networking, dealing with clients, introducing yourself. So let's go. I was having a chat with Overcomer on LinkedIn. He's a copywriter. And at the time we were chatting because, you know, like one week don't pass. Now, he said he had just discovered my podcast, you know, the two weeks prior on Spotify said was looking for me on LinkedIn, but he had some problems doing that because he couldn't get the right name spelling.

Yeah, that's my fault because I've stopped spelling out my name on the podcast, you know, 'cause I don't know, it was just sounding somehow me spelling my name on every single podcast episode. So let me spell it here in case you're like overcomer, you're curious, and you want to look for me where you can find me elsewhere. So the name is Tavishima. That is TAVERSHIMA again, T for Tango, A for Alpha, V for Victor, E for Echo, R for Romeo,

S for I can't remember what S is supposed to be for, S for sugar, H for Hiroshima, I for whatever I is for, and then M for money, and then A for Alpha. So that's Tavishima. Then the surname is Ayede AYEDED for Delta or D for Dog. So that's my name. So that's how you can find me on LinkedIn. But then eventually he was able to find me because he just took my number and put it in Truecolar. So those of you who've been listening to the podcast for a while, and I've been telling you how you can use Truecolar to just do some basic research.

You can see that it works. You just take somebody's number, throw it in Truecolar and it will come up. Take that name, throw it in Google. From there, you'll be able to figure out exactly who this person is. So, you know, small, small, at least for most people anyway. So that's how I was able to find my name. Truecaller, who hooked up with me on LinkedIn, also followed me on YouTube. For those of you who would like to follow me on YouTube, the YouTube handle is a Tavpod.

That is TAVPOD written together as one word. Again, Tavpod, TAVPOD written together as one word. So that's how overcomer of Weibo found me. So they said he likes the podcast because I'm dropping practical knowledge and he liked the episodes where I spoke about how to track prospects with CRM tools and the CRM tool he uses his Google Sheets. Now for those of you who are just listening for the first time, let me slow it down a little bit because there might be sometimes that you're not familiar with now tracking prospects.

OK, first of all, tracking. Why do we need to track? The reason why we need to track is this. In the early days of business, you only have one or two clients and that's OK. When you only have one or two clients, you don't have to remember too many things. If client one says call me on Monday, you remember because there's only one client. And then client 2 says call me on Wednesday. You remember, but then you know, eventually business grows.

You have three clients, you now have 4. You have 5. You have 10, you have 12, you have 50. You know business grows. And by the time you pass like on that kind 3 or 4, it actually is hard to remember. Who did I talk to last week? What did we agree? When am I supposed to call this guy? Is the guy supposed to call me who is owing me money, Who am I owing deliverables and all these sorts of things. So we need something to track all those things.

So tracking absolutely important. Then the another term that he use prospects. No prospect is just anybody who might be interested in your product or your service. Because in the beginning you suppose you're supposed to be talking to everybody, Any reasonable somebody, that person is a prospect. Any reasonable somebody. At first when you just have a phone number, we have an e-mail address or whatever, or you jam the person for the first time,

the person is a contact. Then when you're talking to the person now it looks as if, oh, there's a reasonable something here, the person might be interested. That person now becomes a prospect. Now a prospect just means, you know, you're supposed to follow up with the person and figure out how serious they are, whether they have a want or a need, you know, things like that. That's when you now know whether you have a, a potential deal on the table.

Then when the person transfers money to your account, that person has graduated. The person is not a customer. If you can get the person to come back again and again and again, especially if you are in a much more corporate context, then you now call the person a client. So that's how you know we categorize people. So you start as contacts. You know anybody, you just jam the person in church, that person is a contact.

You talk a bit and it looks as if this person is interested. You exchange phone numbers the person don't become prospect their prospects. You know, you go to follow up and go to toast the person you know eventually the person will transfer you deposit person will transfer you deposit you know 80% you know a hand the person not become customer and then as you do the work for the person and the person is happy in three months time to call you again and now you can say the person is a client.

So that's the progression. So overcome off were saying that he was happy with those episodes where we learned about how to track prospects using CRM tools. Now CRM is customer relationship management tool and basically it's just any tool that exists outside your head that is supposed to keep track of all these things. Who am I talking to? How many people did I talk to last week? Who am I supposed to get back to this week?

Who is owing me something? Who am I owing something? What stage of the deal am I at? You know, these sorts of things. So I've said it lots of times on the phone that to like the dedicated CRM tools, yeah, software that exists on your phone or computers. So ideally, yes, everybody supposed to have CRM. But The thing is, if you don't have CRM, I've made lots of episodes about how you can use your phone as a CRM and then also use your native calendar on your phone.

So whether it's Google Calendar or iPhone calendar or techno calendar or whatever calendar SHA, just use it. And so if you want to know more about that, just subscribe on my YouTube search around you see some of the episodes or just going to ChatGPT or something and then ask, just put in a prompt. How can I use my phone as a CRM tool? You get lots of nice ideas there. But bottom line is always have a tool. Don't be using, don't be using,

don't be using idea and don't be freestyling because that's that's the death of business because it is painful. It has happened to me several times and my prayers that it will not happen to you because back when I was a wedding photographer, I've said it on the show before and the reason why I said is because it was one of the most painful moments of my life because me and this babe were making progress. I mean, minus the fact that she was supposed to be my client.

I was even thinking, haha, I think she's a correct girl if nobody say you know, so we're making progress. And I thought I was going to be waiting photographer, but then I lost track of the call. Eventually I see that's also another thing. You even forget how you store somebody's number. Eventually I remembered her name and then I called her and she was like, oh, that, you know, I lost my phone wanting wanting this is this.

I was wondering how to reach out to you. And by the way, that was the time when I was not on Instagram. So it's not so she could go Instagram. I go and look for me. And then, you know, I asked her, so, OK, so are we still in place? She said, ah, not today is my wedding day. I was crushed because I was thinking this is good money. I was thinking, you know, some 200K will come from this by the time I'm I'm done. So it can happen to everybody.

You can lose track of conversation. So don't keep it in your head. You will lose money. This is how we start losing money. So everybody needs CRM tools now for overcomer off Weibo, what he does is he uses Google Sheets. Google Sheets is like Excel, Microsoft Excel, but the Google version. And that's where he puts people's information in there. And then he tracks his meetings and appointments and things like that by using Google Calendar.

So that's where he will schedule, you know, the next meeting, the next Zoom call, the next site visit, the next office, you know, whatever. So that's it. So that works for now. Some of you say is not ideal. Yes, I agree it's not ideal. But The thing is we have to start from somewhere. In fact, for my clients, I prefer that somebody who starts like this and follows it religiously than people who go and buy the the correct CRM tool and then they never use it.

In fact, I'm sure people are tired of hearing me say this. Yes, there's one of my clients and that's why we're fighting with them currently because the salespeople it's a proper CRM everything is paid for, but they don't use it. So everyday you know, harassing, harassment, harassment. So your Gaga they harass them even me to I would harass them show everyday is harassing uses CRM uses CRM uses CRM. So use it. It's for your own benefit.

If you use it, you close deals, you close deals, you make more money. If you're a career salesperson, you close deals, you make more in, you make more in commissions. So yeah, that's it. And Overcomer also said that he shared the podcast with a friend of his. Thank you very much. Welcome all for for doing that. And the rest of you who have been listening to this podcast for like, you know, 3-4 months, you haven't told anybody about it.

Like, come on, what are you thinking about? If you think that this is good stuff, share the good news people listen as well and let them let them learn from all the goodness that we put out here. So let's see what else, what else, what else then Overcome also said that at hand. The one tip that he liked from the podcast was about how I have said here time and time again that too many people send messages without having a call to action at the end.

So it's hard to explain call to action to most people, call to action just means what do you want the person to do next to move the deal forward. So you should always have some sort of call to action at the end of your your emails, your text messages. You should try to get people to take the next step with you because that is how deals are won. It is called advancements, which means after every single conversation you have with someone, there is something in front you want the person to do that will move the deal forward or something that you will do that will move the transaction forward.

So that is how deals are closed step by step by step. It's like a snail moving forward. The snail will crawl and then stop and then crawl and then stop. That is how complex deals are won in sales and business development. We call that advancements was the term that was coined by Neil Rackham in his book Spin Selling SPIN. Spin is a is a method for qualification, but I will talk about that much later in the episode. So at the end of every e-mail,

suggest a call to action. Now, because lots of people don't get called to actions. What I started saying at some point was I used to tell people that I'm training that look, you know what, every single text message you have ended with question mark. Every single e-mail that you sent ended with question mark, every, everyone. So that's one way that I get people to understand. And so he understands it overcome all the stands.

And so he started ending it with question mark and he saw the difference. Now by the time like this is the way he explained it, like you send a message to somebody and then you say, oh, we have samples available. And then you now put full stop. And the person would be like, oh, OK, the conversation would idea. You said, we have samples. The person said, oh, OK, the conversation would idea. What do you say? We have samples available.

Would you like me to bring some to your office? You see question mark, the person can now say, oh, no, that won't be necessary. In that case, you now know that man, this is not moving forward. At least you brought the thing out into the open or the person can say, sure, no problem. Bring it over to the office again. Since you won't unpack all the samples in your warehouse, you need to ask persons some more questions. Oh, fantastic.

Yeah. I can come over Monday, 8:00 AM. Does that work for you? 8:00 AM works fine. OK. By the way, just so I bring stuff that are relevant. So for the samples, we have this range between this range, what would you be interested in seeing more about or knowing more about? You see question mark. And that's how you're moving forward. One step at a time. It is called advancements moving forward, small by small by small with a crawl.

But eventually we'll get there. It's like the tortoise, the tortoise and the all that story again when we're kids, tortoise and the rabbits. So the tortoise is like that small, small, small, but eventually we get there, right? So that's one thing that he's been implementing and he says that the IT makes a difference instead of just saying we have samples available, full stop. We have samples available. Would you like to see some question mark?

It moves your thing forward. And then somebody says, yeah, we'd like to have a meeting next week and say, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. Next week. Yeah, makes sense, makes sense. So guy, we're going to see now. And then you shake hands and then you leave that. What kind of rubbish is that? Somebody says, let's have a meeting next week. You say, sure, sure. Sounds like a good idea. I'm going to be in Warren Power. I'm going to be in the catcher.

I'm going to be in the solo, you know, around Wednesday, you know, can I drop in then ask advancements personal now say, oh, Wednesday, Oh no, you know what? Then I'll be in Nassau. I'll be on the road. I'm coming back around that kind of Saturday, Sunday, you know. So ask question mark call to action. That is how deals are moved forward. See if you don't believe me, just like overcomer over just like he tried it and he has seen the difference in his business.

Try it, it's not hard. You finish the message. Try and see how you can smuggle a question mark. Never end your text message on a full stop. Never end your e-mail on a full stop question mark. Please. After you have closed the deal, e-mail can be ending on question mark. While in the beginning we need advancements question mark, question mark, call to action, call to action, please. The word is enough for the wise overcome of where booze enjoying it, enjoy it as well.

OK, so now the thing other things that we discussed now overcomer. Now you guys say that he has a problem one client now he's working for a client. The client pays well and the property client has problems with conversions. What conversions means is you know you're talking to people, you're toasting people. You want them to be your customers, but they're not too many of them are taking the next step now overcomer Oh by the overcomer is a copywriter.

So overcomer now in his own opinion, say the reason why people are not converting is because the guys offer the guy product, the guy service No too, you know, no too tough, no too sweet. You know, it happens that sometimes you're working for a customer, but the customer's product is not is not the best and put it that way. So it affects it affects how effectively you can sell on the person's behalf. Because The thing is, you can't sell crap.

You can't deceive customers forever. If your thing is average, other people's things are excellent. Over time, people will be grab gravitating towards the excellent 1. So that's the problem now. So that's the problem. He told the guy that look at this, your product, this your service, you know, we suppose improve our more once we improve it, we'll start getting more conversion, we'll start getting more customers. And he started suggesting ways to the guy say guy changes your product, changes your service.

And the guy was always saying, man, I'm busy, I'm busy, I'm busy, so overcome. And now send me a message, say how far this is situational. What am I supposed to do? So I told her for commander, look, you know what, this guy is not broke. That's the problem. So excuse me, the guy is not broke because he's not broke. Honestly, he doesn't have a problem. I repeat, the only reason why a business person you hire a consultant, the consultant is working for you, the consultant is tell you improve this.

I say the only reason why that client is and it's not changing anything is because the guy has not broke yet. The money that he's making, excuse me, the money that he's making is enough for him. It sounds irrational, I be, but truth of the matter is that unless people do have a problem, they don't move. Clients the only move when body they heart. So when there's something that is putting the client on fire, don't move.

When there's a problem, they will move. If there's an urgent vision, don't move. If there's a sense of urgency, don't move. Outside of that, trust me, you cannot force your client to do nothing and not to tell Overcomer is a painful place to build. Somebody's paying you money. You want the best results. I mean, of course, your reputation is on the line now, but if the person doesn't feel like they don't have problem, they will not move.

Shishi, don't move gang. So my recommendation to overcomer was this. And this is my recommendation to you in case you're in this situation. You're a consultant that paid you money. You're telling Yoga what to do next. Your guy is saying I'm busy and I'm busy. I told him, ask the guy, tell him like this Sir, I'm doing my best to make sure that we achieve XYZ. But it looks as if you are happy with ABC results, is that correct?

Some of you are afraid you don't want, you think it's too direct, but trust me, it's not. It just takes some practice because you know Nigeria were brought up to be very nice, very polite while taught not to be too confrontational and then the other people you know, you know the other people now politicians are no order. They now go to the extreme and become touts. So in Nigeria is like you're either one way or another.

You're either 8 out or you're either on the quiet side, nobody in the middle but you can have these conversations are set of you. So you just ask so respectfully Sir, I've been doing my best to make sure we achieve XYZ in this your business. But as if you're happy with ABC results are you? Is that correct? Lo and behold, overcome as the guy now was the answer. It's like I said, guys like it's OK, there's no force to Georgia.

If our customer says he's OK, If the customer hires you and the customer is doing 22 million every month, you've seen something that if they change the community, 55 million every month. If the customer says he's up to 2,000,000 every month, oh, you do know what can you do? You know your best. So I told him, look, overcome. The offers are very simple. Move on to somebody else or stay there and continue to collect money.

So excuse me, continue to collect money for work you're not proud of. Either way, you have done your professional duty. You have spoken up. Your conscience is clear now because overcomer is a correct guy. I know the overcomer is going to, you know, at some point is going to say, oh, well, you know, Sir, I've been collecting your money and to be honest, there's nothing more I can do here. And then to end their relationship.

Some of you will be saying what that line line, I'll stay there and continue to collect the money. But anyway, let me not force conscience upon anybody. So, you know, to to each his own shadows. No steal from anybody. But yeah, if you're in that situation, that's that's the best you can do. So you ask your guy, you guys happy with the way things are. There's nothing else you can do. You know, either move on. I'm going to work for someone else who you think will listen to you or stay there, a country to collect the money even though you're not proud of the work.

Stan, let's see what else? So this is the reason why when we talk about qualification frameworks, I spoke about spin selling by Neil Rucker. That was like in 1970 something. I've been 1986 or something like that. But either way, that was some good stuff there. Good stuff. So I'm not see this is one of the reasons why I tell the people that look, pay attention to the fundamentals. Stop worrying about the newest is the newest that when it comes to business, when it comes to business, when it comes to medicine, when it comes to engineering, when it comes to accounting, look fundamentals first learn the fundamentals.

Then you can worry about the newest, the shiniest, the whatever. So two people are running from pillar to post trying to learn the newest sales this the newest that like forget all that somebody was saying that book was written in 1982. I can't learn anything from there. Like what do you mean is business is a system. Systems have a coherence. Systems have a way that they work. Everything you know works. How I explained it now self,

what shy is a system? Go and learn the fundamentals. So if I recommend spin selling to you and you say that the book was written in 1986, you won't read it. I'll give you a knock on the head. Go and read that book. I won't tell you where you can find it because I don't want anybody to arrest me for piracy. If you read in between the lines, you understand what I'm saying. All right, Sir was a good book. So in Neil Rackham's book that was written 40 something years ago, he spoke about how implication questions and need payoff questions are important.

Implication question does means implication does means. OK, Sir, boss, we don't solve this problem, you know anything Would there be a problem you need to ask. So in this case, when I told overcome of web, that's a guy that looks, I've been trying to get us to XYZ. Well, it looks like you're happy with ABC. Is that the case? That's a way of asking implication question. You're trying to figure out, is there a problem here?

Because your guy says there's no problem talk. What do you want to do? Again? Now you can take a horse with water. You can force the, the the horse to drink. So you'll be asking all these problems, all these questions, implication questions need payoff questions and let's see what else? OK, 30 minutes. So let me just move on. So that's why all these things are important. Then, like I said, Overcomer also had questions around networking because, yeah, I

listened to three episodes that I made on networking. And by the way, I have more than three episodes on networking. It's just that there was one time where I did a series on networking, so I did like four or five at the stretch, but I have plenty on networking. So like I said, follow on YouTube, search at have pod TAVPOD or search within this podcast player. That's for podcast players that allow you to search within and you'll be able to find the other episodes that I did on networking.

So now Mr. Forbu, just in case you're confused, I really like that song. And that's what I'm saying is again, Forbu, because we have correct names in this country. So he wanted to know something now because guy likes to network and is good in the beginning when we're building our businesses, all join, everyone all join. If he's flyer, try it. If he's networking, try it. If it's direct sales, try it. If he's advertising, try it.

In the beginning, we'll be trying everything until we figure out what works. The one that works, we now double down upon it. All right, So in the beginning we try everything. So for him, networking is working for him. But he said overcome and say he has this problem now. People ask him, what do you do? And then he tells people, oh, I'm a copywriter. And then from there, people will think he's talking about copyright law, you know,

intellectual property protection. And it's confusing people. So overcome, I want to know how can I be introducing myself in a way that is not causing confusion? Because now when I say copyrights people, their mind will be going to law. So I wanted to know what to do. Also introduce himself in a way that avoids clarity. Sorry, I say avoids confusion. I've always confusion and brings clarity. So in one of my older episodes on networking, this was be years ago, must be entering like 3 or 4 years now, I shared a general formula with you guys.

Unfortunately I can't remember who came up with this formula. So I can't credit the guy or credit the girl. So, oh, I've seen the idiot that was blasting his motorcycle. He's driving one kind of isn't coming to park next to me. OK, I see why he was misbehaving. Like I need you. He's a military person. That was a problem with this country. All these military people, they just feel like they're above the law. So that's why he was being a nuisance.

Anyway, where was I? OK, I lost my train of thought. So the formula is this. Now when you're introducing yourself is a basic form. I just say I do X for people who Y so that they can Z. Let me repeat the formula. When introducing yourself as a business person, you say I do X for people who Y so that they can Z. So that is the formula. When you introduce yourself like that, people understand like oh OK, this is who you are and this is what you do.

Now the main questions you need to ask yourself before you can flesh out this formula for yourself. Again, let me repeat the formula is I do X for people who Y so that they can Z. The main question you need to ask yourself is who are your best clients and then what kind of results do you give them? When you ask yourself this question will be able to flesh it out. So we exchange some messages back and forth and then eventually he sent me some things, but the jargon withdraws too much.

The jargon was too much. The first attempt he sent me, he had some big, big terms there. He had he wrote digital marketing campaigns. He also wrote scale faster. He also wrote a marketing copy. He also wrote a grow revenue. Now for those who was listening to this podcast, you will say it's basic. Now everybody understands that, but no, we understand that because it's in house where business people were trying to, you know, so we study all these things so we know what the term means where you meet an ordinary person and you're telling the person digital marketing campaign.

How do you expect the person to understand that? How digital marketing campaign scale faster marketing copy grow revenue. OK, grow revenue to my understand see some of you who say that I'm being unnecessary pedantic here, but I'm not I'm not really Nigeria's yes, we know book, but you know, we look, just trust me on this one. Trust me on this one. You're a copywriter. Don't go around telling people that you know you do digital marketing campaigns like person has no idea what that means.

What does that mean? Google, TikTok, Instagram, like exactly what does it mean? So I told him, I told him, look, most of our clients are non-technical. And I told him answer these questions again. The question again is number one, who are your best clients #2 what kind of results do you give them? But use language that your nieces and nephew who understand, your small, small nieces and nephew use language that they will understand or use language that mumsy and popsy will understand or use language that your girlfriend will understand.

You hear me? Go through this exercise when you're trying to describe who your best clients are and the kind of results you give them. Use language that your nephew and your niece, your brother's children, your sister's children use the kind of language that they will understand. By the way, I'm assuming that your nieces and nephews should be like on that kind, you know, primary 6 JSS one, something like that. So I'm not talking about nursery school.

In fact, if you can explain this so that a nursery school child will understand, no problem. It's all good. The kind of language that moms say and pops, you understand, your uncles are aunties. The kind of thing that you know that your girlfriend will understand because our girlfriends are wise, you know, they love us, they support us and they believe in us. But in all honesty, you know, it is also that they love. They don't necessarily love our profession.

So sometimes you know your girlfriend has been with you 2-3 years and because I've seen you called squirrel. So what does your boyfriend do anyway? So you know what, I'm not sure the guy will now be angry, but how can I say I'm not sure? You don't know what I do. We've been together 2 years. You know guy, calm down, relax. You know she loves you. She truly, truly, truly loves you. But The thing is, some of us, you know, we go about our stuff,

we're talking too much technical blah blah blah blah blah. You know after a while she would turn off, you know you that she loves. It's not your professional so describing a way that she will understand. So after some back and forth, this is what we settled on. Now listen carefully. What we settled on was this that went off web overcome off web was introducing himself is going to say I write words so that businesses can sell their products and services so that they can make more money.

Let me repeat, the next time he tries to introduce himself, he's going to sell something like this. I write words so that businesses can sell their products and services so that they can make more money. It's a big improvement from saying I'm a copywriter, blah blah blah blah blah digital marketing campaigns, blah blah blah blah scale faster blah blah blah market marketing copy blah blah blah grow revenue. You know, blah, blah, blah, 10X,

right? So I know some of you won't like this because it sounds like it's too simple. I write words so that businesses can sell their products and services so that they can make more money. Believe me, it is a big improvement. If I even wanted to make it simpler, I want to make it simpler. But the problem is, you know, when you're dealing with somebody who is educated, you know, we educated people, you know, we like things a bit complex.

So, but believe me, for me, I would have made it even simpler. Now, remember, I've been saying on the podcast, the reason why we go for simple formulas is because a simple formula is easy to say and easy to remember in a networking session. It is easy to carry out. You don't want to come up with the kind of answer when people say, what do you do that if you don't remember a word for word, you know, begin to fumble because the fumbling that you're doing, the stammering that you're doing is because you're trying to remember the right words.

Or somebody will look at you and say this guy, no, get confidence. You're confident in your work was just that you can't remember the exact formula you came up with, but this XYZ thing I do X for Y people so that they can achieve Z results. I was just it's anyway, what is enough otherwise? And the trial is enough to convince you. Just go and try it out. But as a general ruler, as a general rule, please pay attention to those of you listening right now.

Never, never, ever, ever use technical language when talking to clients. I repeat, as a general rule, never use technical language when talking to clients, except when you are selling to a technical crowd. So if you are a copywriter and you are selling your services to other copywriters, the more technical you can be, the better. You will say that you're going to use digital marketing and you're going to do attempt conversion rate optimization using the social and so framework.

Now, because both of you are insiders, the person will understand you one time. So when you're in house or talking to a technical client, feel free. When you're talking to ordinary people, no technical language, don't worry, they won't think you're dumb. Don't think you're daft that you guys listen to this podcast. You clearly don't think I'm daft, do you? Even though I'm not using lots of technical language, What people want to see is that you have mastery.

You understand what you're talking about. You'd be like, say you know, you know, book, be like, say you know, you understand this thing, you have a handle on the concepts. That's what people are looking for. So even if your language is simple, normal, everyday language, but it looks like you understand what's going on, they'll have confidence in you. That is the reason why people close deals in Hausa, That's the reason why people close deals in Igbo, in Yoruba, in ethic, in a BBO, in teeth and then gas in birome in whatever language because that's what people are looking for.

So if you're speaking house out or you're speaking pigeon, but it looks as if you have a mastery of what this is going on, somebody will be confident then they'll go with you. So technical language, please kill it for now, except when necessary. So, and I told overcomer this now, OK, this is the next step, Mr. Affordable, after you learn this formula, I do X for Y people so that they can do Z. The next step is you have to ask them because remember, I keep saying on this podcast, it's not about what you say, It's not about the grammar you speak.

It's about the questions that you ask, because we have to get the other person talking. If the other person does not talk, we don't have all the ammunition that we need to close this deal. If they're not talking, we don't know what their problem is. If they're not talking, we don't know if there's a potential. All I say now is a potential meeting of minds that OK, the products or the service that I have, they might have a need for it.

Won't know the extent of the problem, won't know how to come up with a convincing proposal, won't know how to give an accurate price quote. It is not about what you say, it's about the questions you ask. I repeat, it is not about what you say, it's about the questions that you ask. So when somebody asks you what do you do in a networking session, you say I do X for Y people, excuse me, so that they can Z you now flip it and say and you, what do you do?

The person will respond, you know, ask questions to get more information. When he has more information, you will now use their own circumstances as a case study. When you use their own circumstances as a case study, if there's room for for progress, you can start tossing them beside, you can close the deal. But even if there's no room, at least now they understand properly what you do so that in the future if they go and jam somebody else and is sounding like anything you said, do not say, oh, the last time I was the Hilton, I met this brilliant young man.

Let me check my phone was his name was very interesting. Nigel Delta name I overcome I found it. Yes, it sounds like exactly what overcome I was talking about. So give overcome my call. All right, when we go for networking sections, this is what we are trying to aim for. One, people want to find customers or want to find people who will remember to referrals in the future when they run into people who might need our product or services.

So back to overcomers example, now somebody asked overcomer, what do you do? Overcomer with a smile you say, I write words for businesses so they can sell, market and make money. See, for me, that's how I wanted to simplify it. I write words for businesses so they can sell market and make money. Some of you say our sell market. That sounds Raz. Yes, it sounds Raz. But The thing is, everybody in Nigeria, when you say sell market, we understand what that means.

We're about talking about talking about it in ways that people understand. Look, don't worry. Yeah, we, you know, we know, you know, you'll have master's degrees and you're properly educated and stuff like that. Don't worry. Don't worry. Don't worry about signing to local. There's not a problem. It's not a problem. Be relatable here so I write words for businesses so that they can sell markets and make more money. So our moment.

Some people here having meetings so the guide on the preach. So let me just wind up this window a little bit so that the audio won't come inside here. I don't want the audio to bleed into you know, because I'm much as the guy is preaching a good sermon, I want you guys to listen to my own sermon over here. There's a time for OK, let me not compete with the word of God. So listen to my own podcast when you're done, then you cannot go and listen to the word of God.

What was I I like where Protestant pass or say word of God. All right, what was I now? So I'd have told overcome of Weibo. Now all you say is I write words for businesses so that they can sell market and make more money. Then you're now flipping and you what do you do? The guy will start talking. Oh really? You're an eye doctor. Oh, you're an ophthalmologist? Oh, you're an ophthalmometry? Sorry, I'm not sure what the term is called because there are too many.

Up to something. Ophthalmologist. Optometries. Up to this. Up to that you weren't much. So you get talking. Oh, you're an eye doctor. Oh, OK, cool. OK, interesting. So how do you get customers? How do you get clients? How do you drive sales? Oh, you have a website? Oh, wonderful, wonderful. Oh, what about Instagram? Oh, wonderful Instagram strategy. Oh, nice. OK. What about e-mail marketing? Have you tried e-mail marketing before?

We have a newsletter. Oh, brilliant. Oh, OK. Good, good, good. OK. So for all these things that we're talking about so far, how do you get the most clients through? The person is talking about the business. And what are your most profitable clients come from? The person is talking, talking, talking, talking. Now you've gotten all the information that you need. You can now flip it. You now say, OK, remember when we were talking about websites?

So yes, I remember, you know, you're this kind of website, that kind of website. Yeah, I remember. Now what I do is I write words on websites like yours. That get people to book more appointments. So really say yes, you actually can use your website as a tool to book meetings. People can be booking meetings from your website. And really, I didn't know that was possible. It's very possible. That's what I do, Sir. I'm a copywriter.

That's what copywriters do. You see how you don't weave everything together. You see now if there's room, you can continue to toast the guy in the future. Maybe there's room for business, but the goal is if there is no room for business, we are hoping that next time this up to eye doctor person is having another conversation with another up to eye person and the person is complaining that ah, this is my website useless for the last five years, no single one customer.

He will not remember O2 weeks ago I was talking with 1 brilliant gentleman. His name was like a Nigel Delta name. What was that name? What was that name? The person will now type success. The guy won't see the thing that the guy will now type Good luck. You won't see you won't see the thing that then he will now type prosperity. He won't see anything there. You now remember oh, it was overcomer. You're now typing overcomer and see overcomer of we will say yeah, that's him.

He was a brilliant man and he was talking to me about how we can do our website like this, like this, like that, and we can get booking apartments directly from our website. Oh really? Can I have the person's phone number? Sure. Here it is. Here's the person's phone number. And when you call him, just tell him that Corley sent you. So that's the goal, you see, So you can flip it any which way. If the person say that they've been using Flyers, so let me check time, OK, It's still 5:00,

right? No problem. So if the person say he has been using flyer, no problem. You say OK, you see what these Flyers that you use, what I do is I put words on the flyer to get people to call your phone number more. You see. So that's the general formula. I repeat it one more time. If I repeat it the last time I do X for Y people so that they can Z person would say, ah, don't nod their head. Maybe they haven't understood very well.

You now flip it around and you, what do you do? Don't start talking and ask them more questions. The more they answer questions, eventually you'll be able to do case study on them. If I see the thing works, it's like the opto opto eye person. For instance, somebody asks you, what do you do? I say, oh, I'm an eye doctor. I specialize on working with teenage children so that we can correct whatever problems they have now, so it doesn't become a problem in old age, you know,

something like that. And then you ask the person, you know, ask the person some questions about, you know, the, the health and something, something, something, excuse me, the more the person talks, you know, say, oh, it's a pity. If we had known about this thing when you are a teenager, some simple lifestyle changes in medication or in health or whatever, you know, you would not have had needs to be wearing this kind of whatever, whatever glasses, blah, blah, blah.

So that's, you know, precisely what it is that I do, you know, how about your kids? Are you taking care of this? Are you taking care of that? You know, you have a conversation, you're using the person as case study. The goal is the next time somebody is somewhere and they complain that this is my son, Chukwuemeka teacher has been complaining that he was he was dumb. We did lesson. We did lesson. After a while, it became clear that Chukwuemeka actually is not seeing the board.

So two weeks ago, I ran into a brilliant gentleman, a brilliant eye doctor at social social networking session. What was that guy's name? I think I started as personal research. Say, hey, the person was talking about these sorts of things. So give him a call. Tell him like only century. So that's the goal. So use the formula as the person, what they do, what they do, then ask some more questions from them. The more that they answer, flip it around, use them as a case study.

Now they understand perfectly what it is that you do. So that's it. And that's all for today. So in summary, it is nice talking to you all, not just overcome all for you. Anybody that has hit me up on LinkedIn, it's been a pleasure talking with you. Anybody that hits me up on WhatsApp, it's been a pleasure. The few people who call, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you, especially when women are brave enough to call because I'm not trying to sound sexist, but you know, usually these guys that hit me up more and usually it's text message.

So you know, when the baby is direct and bold enough to call straight, you know, I like it, It's good. Keep it up, keep it up, keep it up. So nice talking to you all. I really appreciate the support all you have given me over the years for this podcast. So like overcomer telling people about the podcast, I appreciate it. Thank you very much, You know, because you guys are doing out of, you know, the love of your own heart.

It's not as if I'm forcing any of you, you know, so thank you. Another reason why I like when people reach out is because it informs future podcast episodes. So you can see how a conversation with Overcomer of Weibo has meant I'm now delivering value to other people because we're talking about problems that he has in his business and we're talking about things that he has applied in his business that he has worked based on what he has said here.

So it's good. Thank you very much for reaching. I really appreciate all of you. Now, most importantly, the reason why I love it when you guys reach out is this it provides evidence to my wife and to my mom. See that people think I'm cool is because the problem is, you know, I'm not sitting around in the house. You know, I'm an ordinary guy, you know, just wearing boxer, you know, watching Netflix, You know, yesterday my wife told me that my happy they smell that I'm not having bath.

Well, you know, so after a while, people, you know your house, you know, don't rate you again. They just see you as you know. So when I get these messages, I can show my fancy babe. You see what outside they rape me. I tell her, look, I appreciate me outside. Your boys a speck, your boys something else that people rape me. They value me. If my mom see to my mom will be laughing. I say, look, Mommy, your boy is not a boy anymore.

See these messages, People value me. They love your boy. I'm going to come up. So, yeah, thank you very much. You keep on giving me evidence to continue to show my mom, see. And yeah, to show my wife that I also my my kids as well, that, yeah, people think that is important. So thank you very much. And I said this before, I want to say it again. I talk for free. This conversation I had with affordable. He didn't pay one single couple.

I'm OK talking for free. I'm OK answering one or two questions. But, you know, you're right. People say that after a while, when the handshake is reaching the elbow, then there's a problem. So I can answer one or two questions. But when our handshake is now reaching the elbow, look, this will become a paid engagement, right? So but one or two questions, yeah, I'll ask you. But then when your question is now going from handshake to elbow, I'll say, look, you know what?

At this point, you know, let's just make this thing a paid consultation. You know, if you want to be able to call me on top, you know, have me on call 247 that look, let's get serious about this and let's formalize this thing, all right? But you reach out to me, you have one or two questions. Sure, no problem. I'll talk to you for free. It's not a problem. If you don't believe me, if you follow overcome off Weibo, if you follow him on LinkedIn, you can ask him how much he paid.

The answer is zero. You didn't pay your thing, so reach out. I don't have a problem with that, but please, for those of you who reach out, don't ask me for money, it's rude. Do not ask me for money, it's rude. I have over 1200 podcast here in the feed that you're listening to right now over 1200 podcast. I dropped that thing for free. You're getting value for free. What I reaching out to me asking money for it's rude.

Then also don't ask me for partnerships except if there's something that will benefit me. Too many of you are reaching out to me. I say, oh, partnership, collaboration, something, something, something. By the time you describe everything and I ask you what's in it for me, you now start telling me some funny things. You now start telling me that discount is the benefit. Like how is the discount going to benefit me? It's still money entering your pockets.

Discount. That's the benefit for me. Come on, be serious here. And I wasn't told me accountability partner like oh really? You have business problems? I'll help you solve your business problems. Then in return the benefit for me is that you will be my accountability partner. OK, I'll pay you money and then you will be my own accountability partner. Come on. Come on. It's not an insult. Ain't no patronizing me. Are we in primary school?

Come on. So if you call up, you say you want partnership, your own collaboration, and it's an idea that both of us can make money. I mean, so good, I'm chasing money too. Now if you come up, I say we'll do like this. Run. I'm like this at the end of the day, 6040, Yeah, no problem. Now, I'm not greedy. I'm not greedy at all. I'm not greedy. So you're going to say partnership or collaboration? Let this thing be genuine.

So that's it. Summary. I love you all and appreciate all of you who reach out to me. The only people I have a problem with are the takers. So if you are taker please just stay in your lane. Continue to enjoy the podcast episode. So please stay in your lane. You know don't annoy me. I have only been rude to one person on this podcast. I don't want to be rude to another person. So that's it and that's all. Remember, if you would love to connect, call, send me a text message or a WhatsApp message on 08064662140.

And if you're ready for more ideas, more tips, more strategies for the Nigerian market, you're in luck. Like I said, there's over 1000 episodes, in fact, 1200 and something episodes in this very feed. If you're on YouTube, scroll and check your eyes are not deceiving you. It's more than 1200 episodes. I've been doing this for over 5 years. So wherever you are in this particular feed, all this goodness is here and it's here for free.

So scroll, take advantage for free, binge for free, but don't just binge. You write down the thing that you think, oh, that's interesting. Then go and apply that thing so that when you reach out to me, you can reach out like overcome of Weibo to tell me that you know what, dude, you said this, I tried it. This was the result. That is the kind of thing that I like to hear. So thanks for reaching out, overcomer. Thanks for reaching out people who've reached out in the past and for those of you who reach out in the future.

Again, thank you very much for your support. I'll see you guys soon.